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Tomlapaz
  • From:USA

Date Posted:29-01-2018 12:47:07Copy HTML

Evolution also being a faith system, this forum seems to be a good fit for this.   Some notes taken some time ago, cannot remember from who or where.


Three kinds of Evolution (as to how the term gets used in a variety of ways)

  1. Change over time: Of this there is observable proof
  2. Micro evolution: small changes within each kind.   Of this there is observable proof
  3. Macro evolution: transmutation of "species".  Darwinism.  No proof of all.

Two Pillars of Evolution

  1. Life from Non life:  No proof at all
  2. Transmutation of 'species': No transitional forms.   Missing links are missing

For evolution to stand, both of these foundational points  must be proven to have occurred.  As it is, neither one has any proof at all.   Note: 'species' may be better replaced, depending, by 'genus' or perhaps even higher.    See link discussion below on definitions.

Irreducible Complexity

The living cell is super complex and only works when all of the complex parts are assembled and functioning.   The removal of one of the parts would not make the cell less functional, it would not function at all.  The complexity of the cell could not have evolved one step at a time, it is irreducibly complex.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Species

In biology, a species is the basic unit of biological classification and a taxonomic rank, as well as a unit of biodiversity, but it has proven difficult to find a satisfactory definition. Scientists and conservationists need a species definition which allows them to work, regardless of the theoretical difficulties.

Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Yobbo Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #1
  • From:New_zealand

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:29-01-2018 02:02:46Copy HTML

Oh dear!
"Les hommes ne font jamais le mal si complètement et joyeusement que lorsqu'ils le font par conviction religieuse." Blaise Pascal
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #2
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:29-01-2018 10:11:19Copy HTML

 Evolution has nothing to do with faith.  It is all fact-based.  We have observed speciation in the wild.  There is a lot of documented proof of macroevolution.  We have also observed that in the wild....a new species via polyploidy. We have mapped genomes from far off different lands that match perfectly the age of rock (tectonics) and the molecular clock.  We have linked phylogenetic trees genetically.  We have seen human evolution.  There are tons of transitional fossils that support the genetic record.  All these things that Tomas has no comprehension of....yet seems to consider himself worthy to announce it is all faith.

Life from nonlife has zero to do with evolution of life.  Aliens may have tossed a bacterium onto earth.....but from there it all evolved.  Perhaps you were confusing evolution with abiogenesis.  Start a new thread.

Irreducible complexity has been disproven so many times it is hard to keep track. Here is factual EVIDENCE YOU WONT READ.

http://www.millerandlevine.com/km/evol/design2/article.html

https://www.theguardian.com/science/punctuated-equilibrium/2011/jan/10/2

https://www.theguardian.com/science/punctuated-equilibrium/2011/jan/10/2

Tomas, you are a liar and an idiot.


In realityland, we call that dishonesty.

Yobbo Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #3
  • From:New_zealand

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:29-01-2018 10:21:20Copy HTML

I can't be bothered explaining where the idiot went off in some imaginary refutation of science.
"Les hommes ne font jamais le mal si complètement et joyeusement que lorsqu'ils le font par conviction religieuse." Blaise Pascal
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #4
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:29-01-2018 11:28:50Copy HTML

 We can take a wolf from the forest and in a very short geologic time have Chihuahuas and Irish Wolfhounds.....and idiots think we cannot have more substantial change in organisms over tens or hundreds of millions of years more time.  The Chihuahua can no longer interbreed with the Irish wolfhound in these few short years since we have domesticated them....the definition of a new species.  We still call them dogs, but if we found these two in the wild, they would be different species.....the definition of which is the inability to interbreed.

We see major changes in a very short geologic time in many species, it is easy to infer the changes would be even greater in much much longer time frames, and the tangible proof of this exists in the genetic, pylogenetic, biogeographic and fossil record.

Tomas...well....is very ignorant of all these data.....yet he feels like he is qualified to render his ignorant conclusion.  Pathetic.

Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #5
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:30-01-2018 12:35:45Copy HTML

I see the faithful are defending their faith.
Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #6
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:30-01-2018 07:56:42Copy HTML

 I see the liar continuing to lie.  I guess that is what an idiot like Tomas says when he has no response to any of the science in the links I posted. 

Nothing about Evolution is remotely related to faith lying Tomas.  It is related to tangible genetic analysis, geology, chemistry, and much more that you are wholly ignorant of.....yet feel qualified to make statements about its veracity.   That would be the Oxford definition of willful ignorance.

Yobbo Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #7
  • From:New_zealand

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:30-01-2018 08:21:28Copy HTML

If I may ask Tomás, what does he get out of all his denials of science, his evasion of  answers and simply not addressing any questions directed at him?
"Les hommes ne font jamais le mal si complètement et joyeusement que lorsqu'ils le font par conviction religieuse." Blaise Pascal
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #8
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:30-01-2018 08:58:31Copy HTML

 He gets to avoid debating about the reality that he wishes did not exist.
Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #9
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:30-01-2018 11:46:57Copy HTML

The faithful continue to protest, insisting their faith is really science.
Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #10
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:31-01-2018 08:59:29Copy HTML

 The idiot continues to lie and cannot answer any questions.  You cant just say "no it isn't".  You have to say why.  You have to show why it is not science and why it is faith.  I have showed you science.  How is the genetic record a leap of faith?  How is the biogenetic record faith?  How is aging the earth with isochronic techniques faith?  How are our direct observations of macroevolution, "faith".  You cannot answer any of these questions, you just stomp your feet like a child and say "no it isn't".

Pathetic lying fool.

Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #11
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:31-01-2018 11:10:41Copy HTML

And the faithful continue to cry out heresy, yet failing to notice the errors in their thinking; the pot calling the kettle black.
Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #12
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:01-02-2018 12:19:28Copy HTML

Yes, the faithful (you) do indeed continue to cry out heresy about evolution.....in your ignorance and delusional stupidity.  The truest thing you've said in years Tomas.

Us scientists cry out with data and evidence....that you repeatedly ignore and cannot explain what it has to do with faith.  You are a very dishonest person Tomas.

Your belief system is faith.  You have faith that genesis is true with no evidence whatsoever.   You have faith god exists with no evidence whatsoever.   Now you criticize others for allegedly having faith (even though science and the fact of evolution has nothing to do with faith). This makes sense to you???? Your entire belief system is faith, but you seem to hate that others that you claim are using faith.  That only makes sense to a delusional idiot like yourself.

In any event, when you can tell how faith is involved in sequencing a genetic molecular clock with agarose gel electrophoresis that proves two distant animals are related phylogenetically after thousands or millions of years of separation, which also matches perfectly the fossil and the isochronic dating record for corroboration of the facts, then Ill believe in God.  (sadly you have no clue what I just said, wont look up any of it to try to understand, will ignore it...and repeat "faith" 100 times or as long as I keep responding)

Tomas' complete and comprehensive argument against evolution over all these years is "no it isn't" without knowing the first thing about the science......and then telling others how their view of the science is wrong.

You are delusional moron Tomas.





Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #13
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:01-02-2018 02:07:22Copy HTML

And the faithful continue to cry out heresy for questioning Darwinian evolution, yet failing to notice the errors in their thinking; the pot calling the kettle black.
Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #14
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:02-02-2018 12:43:03Copy HTML

 I havent ever cried heresy.  The liars keep lying.  You are free to question it all you like.  That is healthy.  That is a part of science.  Question away.  I will attempt to answer any and all your questions LIKE I ALWAYS DO.

Your problem is you question without any knowledge, which is not a problem in and of itself. It is no shame not to know anything about evolution as you clearly dont.  The problem is that while you don't know anything about evolution, don't try to ever read or learn anything about evolution, and have no intention of ever doing so, you seem to think yourself capable of making proclamations about evolution. You do not have the skill set to do so.

It would be like me saying string theory is wrong. I have no idea how to explain string theory, much like you could not explain any of the science behind evolution if I held a gun to your head. The difference is I don't make proclamations about things for which I am wholly ignorant, and you do.

Very dishonest.

I know you don't even read these responses.  I put them here so everyone can see what a dishonest liar you are.  Isnt that fun?


Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #15
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:02-02-2018 02:37:51Copy HTML

And the Darwinian faithful continue to cry out heresy for questioning their priests, yet failing to notice the errors in their thinking; the pot calling the kettle black.   Unable to see the errors of their ways, despite the evidence.
Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Yobbo Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #16
  • From:New_zealand

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:02-02-2018 06:06:32Copy HTML

Reply to Tomlapaz

And the Darwinian faithful continue to cry out heresy for questioning their priests, yet failing to notice the errors in their thinking; the pot calling the kettle black.   Unable to see the errors of their ways, despite the evidence.

Point out these "errors in thinking".   Give us details. 

In any discussion it is important that neither party resorts to wild generalisations..

"Les hommes ne font jamais le mal si complètement et joyeusement que lorsqu'ils le font par conviction religieuse." Blaise Pascal
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #17
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:02-02-2018 06:44:24Copy HTML

 And the Darwinian faithful continue to cry out heresy for questioning their priests, yet failing to notice the errors in their thinking

___ 

 

What errors?  Be specific.  You have never identified any. 

Here is the problem...you haven't questioned anything.  You merely say..."it is wrong", "it is in error".  That isn't questioning, and you provide no technical rebuttal to support your claims.

 I'm glad you keep responding to keep this record of what a dishonest lying piece of shit you are.

Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #18
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:03-02-2018 04:47:15Copy HTML

I have pointed out errors in both of your posts, and you both continue to evade, etc.


So I have to accept - the Darwinian faithful here are just going to cry heresy when evolution is questioned.  (those who actually buy into it for scientific reasons alone are a different group).

Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Yobbo Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #19
  • From:New_zealand

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:03-02-2018 07:05:07Copy HTML

Reply to Tomlapaz

I have pointed out errors in both of your posts, and you both continue to evade, etc.


So I have to accept - the Darwinian faithful here are just going to cry heresy when evolution is questioned.  (those who actually buy into it for scientific reasons alone are a different group).


You have not.  You make the occasional comment without any evidence which is not "pointing out errors".  We are both science educated and require, more properly demand evidence to back up any claim.
"Les hommes ne font jamais le mal si complètement et joyeusement que lorsqu'ils le font par conviction religieuse." Blaise Pascal
Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #20
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:03-02-2018 10:28:13Copy HTML

We are both science educated

And yet you hide it so well here..........

Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Yobbo Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #21
  • From:New_zealand

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:04-02-2018 01:30:51Copy HTML

Instead of mindless sniping why not produce some evidence backing your claims?
"Les hommes ne font jamais le mal si complètement et joyeusement que lorsqu'ils le font par conviction religieuse." Blaise Pascal
Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #22
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:04-02-2018 02:06:01Copy HTML

That is what I have been asking of you - and still waiting.

Instead, you played games in the other thread.   Hardly a sign of 'scientifically educated'.

Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #23
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:05-02-2018 11:52:28Copy HTML

 Instead of mindless sniping why not produce some evidence backing your claims?

___


Tomas, provide evidence to back a claim......what are you fucking nuts?

Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #24
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:06-02-2018 01:54:54Copy HTML

No kidding - its like asking Skw or Yobbo for evidence for the claims they have yet to back up.

Heaven forbid that would happen..................

Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #25
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:06-02-2018 11:47:32Copy HTML

 OMG.  Ive been waiting for over five years for you to answer every single question Ive ever asked you.  You claimed you had scientific evidence of creation years ago....among many other claims you have never supported.

I provide evidence and links for every claim Ive ever made about evolution.

Congrats, You exploded the lie detector, the irony meter, and the hypocrisy meter all at the same time.


Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #26
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:09-02-2018 02:24:25Copy HTML

I have been waiting for you to provide actual evidence for evolution - but, as is common with such faithful devotion, you just repeat the dogma you have been taught, with no real thought put into it.

Sad.   Not uncommon, but nevertheless sad.

Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #27
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:09-02-2018 10:45:40Copy HTML

 I provided evidence of evolution many times liar.  Facts.  Genetic analysis. Actual observations of speciation in the wild...including macroevolution.  To say I have provided no evidence is perhaps the most dishonest thing you have ever claimed.

I have asked you to refute evidence and back your claims for years....and you have never done so.

You are a lying sack of shit.


Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #28
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:09-02-2018 10:46:54Copy HTML

 Do a search for evolution in the thread and see how many times my name comes up with links to scientific articles of evidence.

How you can claim to be righteous and lie like you do is more unbelievable than the existence of god.

Ex_Member Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #29
  • From:Unknown

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:09-02-2018 11:37:13Copy HTML

 If direct observations of speciation over time with both morphologiocal and genetic measurements (tangible facts) is not evidence of evolution (it is actually the dictionary definition of evolution), what would a lying idiot like you call evidence?
Tomlapaz Share to: Facebook Twitter MSN linkedin google yahoo #30
  • From:USA

Re:Evolution: Short summary

Date Posted:10-02-2018 01:21:57Copy HTML

Someone is not reading well - yes you provided links to what you 'think' were evidence for evolution.

And you 'think' that because you are faithful to this dogma.   Thus reason cannot prevail with you.

No disagreement over that.

Come worship Jesus, born King of the Jews.
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